Comments on: Christian arguments under siege, Part II : The nature of the Christian “faith” and the joke of free will http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/theedgecrusher/christian-arguments-under-siege-part-ii-the-nature-of-the-christian-faith-and-the-joke-of-free-will Behold, Bastard son! We are the evil ones. Wed, 17 Mar 2010 15:23:08 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: LeaT http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/theedgecrusher/christian-arguments-under-siege-part-ii-the-nature-of-the-christian-faith-and-the-joke-of-free-will/comment-page-1#comment-6284 LeaT Sat, 27 Jun 2009 13:05:07 +0000 http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/?p=237#comment-6284 It should not, as I was just a "guest" for a long time as well before I became an author. ID is related to the Wordpress account. It should not, as I was just a "guest" for a long time as well before I became an author. ID is related to the Wordpress account.

]]> By: Anath http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/theedgecrusher/christian-arguments-under-siege-part-ii-the-nature-of-the-christian-faith-and-the-joke-of-free-will/comment-page-1#comment-6140 Anath Wed, 24 Jun 2009 04:46:28 +0000 http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/?p=237#comment-6140 I'll cut in here. "Can you even conceive of what it might be like here if all of the good were gone?" Yes. I have actually given the concept of good and evil a great deal of thought and intensive study, and my conclusions are quite different from what you might expect. The concept does not exist in ANY objective state, so one could easily say that "the good IS all gone"--NOW. It was NEVER here. There is only what you PERCEIVE as "good" or "evil", nothing more. I don't really have time to explain the fine details of why I think this right now, but I wrote an essay on it a while back that will give some insight into my work on the issue: <a href="http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/anath/debunking-christianity-25-the-ignorance-of-evil" target="_blank">http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/anath/deb...</a> I have developed a number of the points further since this was written, so please inquire about anything that confuses you or seems unusual. And please, try to step into the shoes of someone who does NOT view the world as black and white, good and evil, god and satan. You clearly misunderstood what Jorrizza meant with his reference to Lucifer (but that is his battle, not mine), which indicates that it would be in your best interest to take a step away from your dogma while engaging us. Otherwise, the attempt is futile. I'll cut in here.

"Can you even conceive of what it might be like here if all of the good were gone?"

Yes. I have actually given the concept of good and evil a great deal of thought and intensive study, and my conclusions are quite different from what you might expect. The concept does not exist in ANY objective state, so one could easily say that "the good IS all gone"–NOW. It was NEVER here. There is only what you PERCEIVE as "good" or "evil", nothing more.

I don't really have time to explain the fine details of why I think this right now, but I wrote an essay on it a while back that will give some insight into my work on the issue: http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/anath/deb...

I have developed a number of the points further since this was written, so please inquire about anything that confuses you or seems unusual. And please, try to step into the shoes of someone who does NOT view the world as black and white, good and evil, god and satan. You clearly misunderstood what Jorrizza meant with his reference to Lucifer (but that is his battle, not mine), which indicates that it would be in your best interest to take a step away from your dogma while engaging us. Otherwise, the attempt is futile.

]]> By: angiebarna http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/theedgecrusher/christian-arguments-under-siege-part-ii-the-nature-of-the-christian-faith-and-the-joke-of-free-will/comment-page-1#comment-6130 angiebarna Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:54:19 +0000 http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/?p=237#comment-6130 At that point, my mom shared that there were spirits haunting my apartment, which probably followed my son to her house and then to theirs. The spirits didn't stay with them though, they came back to haunt my place some more…I still wonder if my little guy (whose now 16) was the one they were most attracted to - it seemed that way. I can’t even express how hard it was seeing him go through this. After several exhausting months of these sorts of incidences, a woman from church told me she knew how to cast out demons. She said the Bible teaches us how to use God's word as our sword against demons and she offered to come over and help me. I was desperate for answers. We did a lot of praying, quoting scripture and commanded the demons to leave. She said they fear God and MUST obey his word - and they did!!! I never experienced another incident after telling them to leave and my son never had to suffer another night of their torment, which was a huge relief after living through months of their mental torture every single night. I no longer fear demons because I know that I have God on my side and his power is much greater than theirs - they HAVE to obey him. I put my faith in the Creator, the real ruler of everything in the universe. He is the ruler over Satan and his demons. That may be altruistic, but I experienced the truth in God’s word first hand. I have complete trust my personal experiences. I’ve had other experiences with demons, so if anyone is interested in hearing about them I’d be happy to share. After interacting with the evil ones, you don’t deny their reality. I’ve always wondered why God allowed these events in my life – why the fallen angels were revealed to me instead of heavenly angels. Still wondering about that, but I have gratitude that I no longer feel vulnerable to them. PS - I still couldn't get it all in one message, but I put in small chuncks at a time by clicking on the EDIT button. At that point, my mom shared that there were spirits haunting my apartment, which probably followed my son to her house and then to theirs. The spirits didn't stay with them though, they came back to haunt my place some more…I still wonder if my little guy (whose now 16) was the one they were most attracted to – it seemed that way. I can’t even express how hard it was seeing him go through this.

After several exhausting months of these sorts of incidences, a woman from church told me she knew how to cast out demons. She said the Bible teaches us how to use God's word as our sword against demons and she offered to come over and help me. I was desperate for answers. We did a lot of praying, quoting scripture and commanded the demons to leave. She said they fear God and MUST obey his word – and they did!!! I never experienced another incident after telling them to leave and my son never had to suffer another night of their torment, which was a huge relief after living through months of their mental torture every single night. I no longer fear demons because I know that I have God on my side and his power is much greater than theirs – they HAVE to obey him. I put my faith in the Creator, the real ruler of everything in the universe. He is the ruler over Satan and his demons.

That may be altruistic, but I experienced the truth in God’s word first hand. I have complete trust my personal experiences.

I’ve had other experiences with demons, so if anyone is interested in hearing about them I’d be happy to share. After interacting with the evil ones, you don’t deny their reality. I’ve always wondered why God allowed these events in my life – why the fallen angels were revealed to me instead of heavenly angels. Still wondering about that, but I have gratitude that I no longer feel vulnerable to them.

PS – I still couldn't get it all in one message, but I put in small chuncks at a time by clicking on the EDIT button.

]]> By: angiebarna http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/theedgecrusher/christian-arguments-under-siege-part-ii-the-nature-of-the-christian-faith-and-the-joke-of-free-will/comment-page-1#comment-6129 angiebarna Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:40:19 +0000 http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/?p=237#comment-6129 At that point, my mom shared that there were spirits haunting my apartment, which probably followed my son to her house and then to theirs. The spirits didn't stay with them though, they came back to haunt my place some more…I still wonder if my innocent, little guy was the one that actually being targeted – it seemed that way. I can’t tell you how much I hated seeing him go through this. At that point, my mom shared that there were spirits haunting my apartment, which probably followed my son to her house and then to theirs. The spirits didn't stay with them though, they came back to haunt my place some more…I still wonder if my innocent, little guy was the one that actually being targeted – it seemed that way. I can’t tell you how much I hated seeing him go through this.

]]> By: angiebarna http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/theedgecrusher/christian-arguments-under-siege-part-ii-the-nature-of-the-christian-faith-and-the-joke-of-free-will/comment-page-1#comment-6127 angiebarna Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:34:25 +0000 http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/?p=237#comment-6127 Since I'm on the subject of Satan and his demons, I mentioned earlier that I have faith that God has power over the realm of evil. I know this to be true because I've had several interactions with evil spirits. When I was 25 (I'm now 40), I had an apartment exercised after experiencing undeniable hauntings. I lived alone (well, with a 2 year old, but no other adults.) Anyway, my son started seeing things, waving hello at the ceiling, pointing and showing me things when nothing was there. At the very same time he began the “sightings,” he also started experiencing severe night terrors. One night during one of his episodes, I brought him into bed with me to calm him down. I laid him on my chest and he eventually quieted down and started to fall asleep. Just as he was getting ready to doze off, he rolled off of me and was now on his back next to me. He opened his eyes, got a terrified look on his face, pointed at the ceiling directly above our heads and began screaming. I didn’t know how to deal with this – the screaming, pointing, and terror happened nearly every night. I began to feel very frightened and vulnerable. I started sleeping with lots of lights on, but as you can imagine we weren’t getting a lot of sleep. One night, I went to bed with 3 night lights plugged in, my closet light on, the bathroom light on, the hall light on, my son's closet light on and the kitchen light on. I woke up in the middle of the night and every single one of them was burned out! That cannot happen by coincidence. When I went to work, my mom kept my son for me at her house. (I should mention she is a Christian.) One day while my son was with her, she was walking through her kitchen when the glass top stove shattered into a million pieces and flew out toward her. She wasn't even cooking anything, just walking through the kitchen. In the midsummer’s heat when the temperature was in the 90’s, my home and car air conditioners stopped working on the same day. That could have been coincidence, but with everything else going on, I chalked it up to another spiritual attack. Another day when my son was at her house, my grandparents stopped by to visit. My mom didn't share with them that we had been experiencing bizarre, supernatural things. When my grandparents got home, they called and said their house was haunted. Their garage door was going up and down on its own, lights were turning on and off on their own and the television was turning on and off by itself. They were terrified as nothing like this had ever happened before – or since. Since I'm on the subject of Satan and his demons, I mentioned earlier that I have faith that God has power over the realm of evil. I know this to be true because I've had several interactions with evil spirits. When I was 25 (I'm now 40), I had an apartment exercised after experiencing undeniable hauntings. I lived alone (well, with a 2 year old, but no other adults.) Anyway, my son started seeing things, waving hello at the ceiling, pointing and showing me things when nothing was there. At the very same time he began the “sightings,” he also started experiencing severe night terrors. One night during one of his episodes, I brought him into bed with me to calm him down. I laid him on my chest and he eventually quieted down and started to fall asleep. Just as he was getting ready to doze off, he rolled off of me and was now on his back next to me. He opened his eyes, got a terrified look on his face, pointed at the ceiling directly above our heads and began screaming. I didn’t know how to deal with this – the screaming, pointing, and terror happened nearly every night. I began to feel very frightened and vulnerable. I started sleeping with lots of lights on, but as you can imagine we weren’t getting a lot of sleep. One night, I went to bed with 3 night lights plugged in, my closet light on, the bathroom light on, the hall light on, my son's closet light on and the kitchen light on. I woke up in the middle of the night and every single one of them was burned out! That cannot happen by coincidence. When I went to work, my mom kept my son for me at her house. (I should mention she is a Christian.) One day while my son was with her, she was walking through her kitchen when the glass top stove shattered into a million pieces and flew out toward her. She wasn't even cooking anything, just walking through the kitchen. In the midsummer’s heat when the temperature was in the 90’s, my home and car air conditioners stopped working on the same day. That could have been coincidence, but with everything else going on, I chalked it up to another spiritual attack. Another day when my son was at her house, my grandparents stopped by to visit. My mom didn't share with them that we had been experiencing bizarre, supernatural things. When my grandparents got home, they called and said their house was haunted. Their garage door was going up and down on its own, lights were turning on and off on their own and the television was turning on and off by itself. They were terrified as nothing like this had ever happened before – or since.

]]> By: angiebarna http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/theedgecrusher/christian-arguments-under-siege-part-ii-the-nature-of-the-christian-faith-and-the-joke-of-free-will/comment-page-1#comment-6128 angiebarna Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:32:32 +0000 http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/?p=237#comment-6128 Since I'm on the subject of Satan and his demons, I mentioned earlier that I have faith that God has power over the realm of evil. I know this to be true because I've had several interactions with evil spirits. When I was 25 (I'm now 40), I had an apartment exercised after experiencing undeniable hauntings. I lived alone (well, with a 2 year old, but no other adults.) Anyway, my son started seeing things, waving hello at the ceiling, pointing and showing me things when nothing was there. At the very same time he began the “sightings,” he also started experiencing severe night terrors. One night during one of his episodes, I brought him into bed with me to calm him down. I laid him on my chest and he eventually quieted down and started to fall asleep. Just as he was getting ready to doze off, he rolled off of me and was now on his back next to me. He opened his eyes, got a terrified look on his face, pointed at the ceiling directly above our heads and began screaming. I didn’t know how to deal with this – the screaming, pointing, and terror happened nearly every night. I began to feel very frightened and vulnerable. I started sleeping with lots of lights on, but as you can imagine we weren’t getting a lot of sleep. Since I'm on the subject of Satan and his demons, I mentioned earlier that I have faith that God has power over the realm of evil. I know this to be true because I've had several interactions with evil spirits. When I was 25 (I'm now 40), I had an apartment exercised after experiencing undeniable hauntings. I lived alone (well, with a 2 year old, but no other adults.) Anyway, my son started seeing things, waving hello at the ceiling, pointing and showing me things when nothing was there. At the very same time he began the “sightings,” he also started experiencing severe night terrors. One night during one of his episodes, I brought him into bed with me to calm him down. I laid him on my chest and he eventually quieted down and started to fall asleep. Just as he was getting ready to doze off, he rolled off of me and was now on his back next to me. He opened his eyes, got a terrified look on his face, pointed at the ceiling directly above our heads and began screaming. I didn’t know how to deal with this – the screaming, pointing, and terror happened nearly every night. I began to feel very frightened and vulnerable. I started sleeping with lots of lights on, but as you can imagine we weren’t getting a lot of sleep.

]]> By: angiebarna http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/theedgecrusher/christian-arguments-under-siege-part-ii-the-nature-of-the-christian-faith-and-the-joke-of-free-will/comment-page-1#comment-6126 angiebarna Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:32:22 +0000 http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/?p=237#comment-6126 Since I'm on the subject of Satan and his demons, I mentioned earlier that I have faith that God has power over the realm of evil. I know this to be true because I've had several interactions with evil spirits. When I was 25 (I'm now 40), I had an apartment exercised after experiencing undeniable hauntings. I lived alone (well, with a 2 year old, but no other adults.) Anyway, my son started seeing things, waving hello at the ceiling, pointing and showing me things when nothing was there. At the very same time he began the “sightings,” he also started experiencing severe night terrors. Since I'm on the subject of Satan and his demons, I mentioned earlier that I have faith that God has power over the realm of evil. I know this to be true because I've had several interactions with evil spirits. When I was 25 (I'm now 40), I had an apartment exercised after experiencing undeniable hauntings. I lived alone (well, with a 2 year old, but no other adults.) Anyway, my son started seeing things, waving hello at the ceiling, pointing and showing me things when nothing was there. At the very same time he began the “sightings,” he also started experiencing severe night terrors.

]]> By: angiebarna http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/theedgecrusher/christian-arguments-under-siege-part-ii-the-nature-of-the-christian-faith-and-the-joke-of-free-will/comment-page-1#comment-6125 angiebarna Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:28:03 +0000 http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/?p=237#comment-6125 The evil ones know they are under the command of God, and they fear their day of judgment when they will no longer roam the earth, but will be forced to the bottomless pit for eternity. If they fear their own judgment and eternal punishment, why would any person CHOOSE that same punishment with their own free will? The evil ones would never have chosen the eternal damnation they will be receiving when judgment day arrives. Lucifer had every intention of winning the mutiny in heaven. When he made his free choice to rebel against God, he wasn't planning on losing and could not foresee the consequences of his actions, the impending punishment. He, his fallen angles and any humans who choose him will all share eternal damnation together. Eternal damnation means living eternal life separate from God - separate from everything good, but instead immersed in it's opposite - everything evil. We can't picture how tormenting this situation will be because on earth we have both good and evil. Can you even conceive of what it might be like here if all of the good were gone? Even people who don’t choose God experience the good that is here on earth. Their time on earth is limited and they know their end is coming. Take your alliance seriously - like Satan, his followers will spend an eternity in bondage, with no freedom, no justice, no love, under a ruler who hates human beings, who is seducing people into his dominion so that he can RULE them, LIKE GOD DOES. People were created in God's image and God has such a powerful love for people that he sent his son here to free us from the sin that Satan tries to capture us with - Satan hates that and he hates people. An eternity with Satan is a deliberate choice for injustice and oppression – exactly what you falsely believe Lucifer freed you from, with the exception of that he will not be a loving leader. The evil ones know they are under the command of God, and they fear their day of judgment when they will no longer roam the earth, but will be forced to the bottomless pit for eternity. If they fear their own judgment and eternal punishment, why would any person CHOOSE that same punishment with their own free will? The evil ones would never have chosen the eternal damnation they will be receiving when judgment day arrives. Lucifer had every intention of winning the mutiny in heaven. When he made his free choice to rebel against God, he wasn't planning on losing and could not foresee the consequences of his actions, the impending punishment. He, his fallen angles and any humans who choose him will all share eternal damnation together. Eternal damnation means living eternal life separate from God – separate from everything good, but instead immersed in it's opposite – everything evil. We can't picture how tormenting this situation will be because on earth we have both good and evil. Can you even conceive of what it might be like here if all of the good were gone? Even people who don’t choose God experience the good that is here on earth. Their time on earth is limited and they know their end is coming.

Take your alliance seriously – like Satan, his followers will spend an eternity in bondage, with no freedom, no justice, no love, under a ruler who hates human beings, who is seducing people into his dominion so that he can RULE them, LIKE GOD DOES. People were created in God's image and God has such a powerful love for people that he sent his son here to free us from the sin that Satan tries to capture us with – Satan hates that and he hates people. An eternity with Satan is a deliberate choice for injustice and oppression – exactly what you falsely believe Lucifer freed you from, with the exception of that he will not be a loving leader.

]]> By: angiebarna http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/theedgecrusher/christian-arguments-under-siege-part-ii-the-nature-of-the-christian-faith-and-the-joke-of-free-will/comment-page-1#comment-6124 angiebarna Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:27:40 +0000 http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/?p=237#comment-6124 The evil ones know they are under the command of God, and they fear their day of judgment when they will no longer roam the earth, but will be forced to the bottomless pit for eternity. If they fear their own judgment and eternal punishment, why would any person CHOOSE that same punishment with their own free will? The evil ones would never have chosen the eternal damnation they will be receiving when judgment day arrives. Lucifer had every intention of winning the mutiny in heaven. When he made his free choice to rebel against God, he wasn't planning on losing and could not foresee the consequences of his actions, the impending punishment. He, his fallen angles and any humans who choose him will all share eternal damnation together. Eternal damnation means living eternal life separate from God - separate from everything good, but instead immersed in it's opposite - everything evil. We can't picture how tormenting this situation will be because on earth we have both good and evil. Can you even conceive of what it might be like here if all of the good were gone? Even people who don’t choose God experience the good that is here on earth. Their time on earth is limited and they know their end is coming. The evil ones know they are under the command of God, and they fear their day of judgment when they will no longer roam the earth, but will be forced to the bottomless pit for eternity. If they fear their own judgment and eternal punishment, why would any person CHOOSE that same punishment with their own free will? The evil ones would never have chosen the eternal damnation they will be receiving when judgment day arrives. Lucifer had every intention of winning the mutiny in heaven. When he made his free choice to rebel against God, he wasn't planning on losing and could not foresee the consequences of his actions, the impending punishment. He, his fallen angles and any humans who choose him will all share eternal damnation together. Eternal damnation means living eternal life separate from God – separate from everything good, but instead immersed in it's opposite – everything evil. We can't picture how tormenting this situation will be because on earth we have both good and evil. Can you even conceive of what it might be like here if all of the good were gone? Even people who don’t choose God experience the good that is here on earth. Their time on earth is limited and they know their end is coming.

]]> By: angiebarna http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/theedgecrusher/christian-arguments-under-siege-part-ii-the-nature-of-the-christian-faith-and-the-joke-of-free-will/comment-page-1#comment-6123 angiebarna Wed, 24 Jun 2009 00:27:20 +0000 http://www.antichristian-phenomenon.com/?p=237#comment-6123 The evil ones know they are under the command of God, and they fear their day of judgment when they will no longer roam the earth, but will be forced to the bottomless pit for eternity. If they fear their own judgment and eternal punishment, why would any person CHOOSE that same punishment with their own free will? The evil ones would never have chosen the eternal damnation they will be receiving when judgment day arrives. Lucifer had every intention of winning the mutiny in heaven. When he made his free choice to rebel against God, he wasn't planning on losing and could not foresee the consequences of his actions, the impending punishment. He, his fallen angles and any humans who choose him will all share eternal damnation together. The evil ones know they are under the command of God, and they fear their day of judgment when they will no longer roam the earth, but will be forced to the bottomless pit for eternity. If they fear their own judgment and eternal punishment, why would any person CHOOSE that same punishment with their own free will? The evil ones would never have chosen the eternal damnation they will be receiving when judgment day arrives. Lucifer had every intention of winning the mutiny in heaven. When he made his free choice to rebel against God, he wasn't planning on losing and could not foresee the consequences of his actions, the impending punishment. He, his fallen angles and any humans who choose him will all share eternal damnation together.

]]>